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Following her NOW Conference presentation this summer about teaching with authenticity, Lyndsay Rose joins Tim today for a longer conversation on the topic. Listen as they discuss how not only authenticity, but also the importance of vulnerability and honesty when it comes to our role as teachers. The conversation also delves into suggestions on how to deal with burnout, and Lyndsay offers some of her best advice on how we can learn to fall in love with teaching again.
Full episode transcript below.
Tim:
Welcome to Art Ed Radio, the podcast for art teachers. This show is produced by the Art of Education University, and I’m your host, Tim Bogatz.
I’m looking forward to our conversation today, a conversation that will cover a variety of topics, from authenticity to vulnerability to remembering and reflecting on why we love to teach. My guest is Lyndsay Rose. I will let her introduce herself, but If you were at the last NOW Conference, she may be a familiar voice. She closed the conference with a great presentation on teaching with authenticity which was very well received. I think a lot of similar themes will come up in our conversation today, but we will have the chance to dive in even deeper to some of those ideas. I’m eager to get started, so let me bring on Lyndsay now.
Okay, Lyndsay Rose is joining me now. Lyndsay, how are you?
Lyndsay:
I’m doing well, Tim. I’m very excited to be here with you today. Thank you so much for the opportunity.
Tim:
Oh, we are thrilled to have you. I had an amazing presentation at the Last Now conference. I think that message is definitely worth talking about a little bit more. So I wanted to have you on and kind of dive in a little deeper. But before we do that, I would love for you to just kind of introduce yourself to everybody who’s listening. ah Can you talk about you know what you’ve done before as a teacher, what you’re doing now, and just anything else you want to share about yourself?
Lyndsay:
Sure. Thank you. Yes, everyone. As you know, my name is Lyndsay Rose. I’m originally from Pennsylvania, born and raised. And that is most of the work that I’ve done as an educator in the last 11 years. I was a teacher in a charter school, one for 800 some kiddos. I have worked at the Pennsylvania College of Art and Design. I mostly spent the majority of my time at the Lancaster County Youth Intervention Center, where I worked with adjudicated youth for about 10 years, and that has been the absolute joy in my teaching career. And most recently I’ve been kind of pivoting a little bit in the art education career. I was the keynote speaker at Kutztown University at their annual art education conference. And most recently as well, I’ve been part of the juror for the Scholastic National Visual Art and Writing Awards, which has been a delight getting to see artwork from all all over the nation.
Tim:
Yeah, that’s really cool. I love participating in Scholastic Awards. I think that’s a great opportunity for kids. So that’s really cool to hear that you’re doing that.
As I said, at your Art Ed Now Conference presentation, you talked a lot about authenticity and why we need to be authentic as teachers. And I love that idea. I love the idea of teaching with authenticity. Can you talk about what authenticity means to you and more importantly, why authenticity is important for teachers?
Lyndsay:
Yes, thank you. So I think what’s important is to first kind of understand what the word authentic means. I think it can kind of lose its way in translation for different folks at different meetings. um But really the true definition of authenticity comes from authentic meaning genuine, not false, true. Especially in teaching, as we talk about teachers and the importance of having it in alignment with your true self. What I really want to know is why you’re a teacher? Why do you want to teach? And it really comes from you. It comes from inside of you and and true in alignment.
And I think what I challenge teachers to understand or to think about, to question is really what feels right and what doesn’t when you’re teaching. Because we all have this idea of why we became teachers. We all know that we love teaching what most of us do, right? um But what is that hiccup? What is getting lost in translation, what is getting lost in the job, what’s getting lost in the career that’s not in alignment with who you are? So just a quick example of something that’s not authentic to me is wearing a unisex t-shirt, right? It just doesn’t feel right to me. Every time I put it on, it just chokes my neck, and the sleeves are too long, and it’s so boxy. So that’s just a really kind of surface level idea of what is not authentic to me. It’s not true to me. It doesn’t fit right. It doesn’t feel right, right?
So if you’d like to hear a story about a teaching authenticity kind of dilemma and Something that I have battled with in the past was kind of selling my soul if you will um I had a parochial school approach me about doing some programming and while I am a spiritual religious person, my values weren’t in alignment with the school and how much I wanted it.
Tim:
Okay.
Lyndsay:
I wanted the salary. I wanted the job. I wasn’t desperate per se, but I really Really wanted a job and I had an interview I talked with the director and I said listen I would love to be transparent and upfront with you, but I don’t know about this religion.
I don’t understand it. It’s not something that I know about, and he’s like, well, it’s okay. We just need you in here. Can you just lie? Can you just lie on your resume?
Can you just lie to beyond that and it didn’t fit? feel right. It didn’t feel authentic. And the overwhelming stress and the floodgates of, oh my gosh, well, if I accept this, then I would have to learn about the religion really quick.
Tim:
Yeah.
Lyndsay:
I would have to act this way, learn this way, know this way. And that’s not authentic. And I feel something important for us to understand is when we’re we’re not authentic to ourselves, it’s not helping anybody else around us.
So if let’s say I took that job and I pretended to be this religion that I wasn’t. Not only am I putting myself in jeopardy and my values, But my students, what if my students would ask me a question and I would have no idea?
And then parents would get concerned and the administration would get concerned and all because I got asked to lie about this and it didn’t feel right.
Tim:
Yeah.
Lyndsay:
So I think the idea of being authentic, especially in your teaching, in your job, does it feel right or does it not feel right? Do we try to rationalize with our brains? um Yes, I can make this work. Yes, I can teach myself about X, Y, and Z just to fit in, just to get that. It’s really sacrificing so much more when we’re not staying true to an alignment with who we are, what we know, and what is true to ourselves.
Tim:
Yeah, that’s well said. And I actually I appreciate that story, but I want to drill down a little bit into something you said at the beginning of that answer, just the idea of, you know, falling in love with teaching or or falling back in love with teaching. And I think the one thing that resonated with teachers when it came to your now conference presentation was the idea that we can fall back in love with teaching because I feel like everybody’s been there. The longer you teach, the more things can become sort of disillusioning for you or difficult for you. And it’s tough to remedy that sometimes. And I feel like we hear about burnout and negativity. We talk about that a lot and don’t talk as much about the positive side of teaching. And I’ll be honest, like I’m guilty of that as well. So my question for you is, how can we go about finding what we love about teaching or remembering what we love about teaching?
Lyndsay:
Ooh, good question, good question. So my opinion and my thought, now folks are able to disagree and we can have a really nice conversation about this disagreement, but to me, I feel like burnout negativity, it comes from external sources and not our own. So what I mean by that is I’m obsessed with like Lord of the Rings.
Tim:
Okay.
Lyndsay:
So anything that you can think about, any kind of movie or any reference or book or television show that you can think about really long time ago when humans were just kind of humans and we just were out in the element.
We had food, shelter, water. We had our kind of place in our community and that was it. And I think about my teaching, my love for teaching that way. So if I lived all that long time ago, if I was how many hundred years ago and I knew in my bones, I knew it was up to me to be a teacher, I would teach a couple of kids, whatever it was at that time, whether it was reading or gardening or whatever the task was, making bread, making shoes, and you just taught and it felt right to you, it felt good to you.
And now we fast forward and we’re in 2024 and just the profound responsibility put on teachers. I feel that’s where the burnout and the negativity come from because you just don’t have a couple of kids that you’re teaching something very natural and authentic.
We are as educators, now expected to teach. Like I said, at one point in my school, I was 800 kids just for me, right? we also have we have parents, we have admin, we have back-to-school nights, we have IEPs, we have all of these different things that are happening to us. We have communications. We have all of these stresses and pressures. We have art clubs and parents and other people wanting your supplies and wanting you to donate and wanting to do.
So all of these external things are put upon us that is completely not teaching. It’s not in alignment with who we are knowing that what we want to do is help kids.
Tim:
Yep.
Lyndsay:
Well, in my example, I love teaching kids and I can’t do that nowadays. I can’t do that really in 2024 because I’m so overstimulated and I’m so burnt out of what is put upon me that I never asked for.
So I think it’s very hard and challenging to be a teacher in 2024 because you’re you’re so far away from your alignment of just wanting to make those meaningful connections with kids.
Tim:
Yeah, absolutely. Yes. yes
Lyndsay:
So it’s not very popular, but to really work through burnout and negativity really just comes from understanding your boundaries and your balance.
So please take it from me. I’m a Libra. I’m the scale astrology. It’s all about balancing your life. It’s about understanding the demands of your job are so far away from your alignment, so you must say no. Can you say no to things that are people that are asking you, even admins asking you? Because ah, again, coming back to that kind of story just a bit ago, I don’t want to lie, and I don’t want to be disingenuous. Who’s that girl who does the organization, Marie Kondo?
Tim:
Marie Kondo, yes.
Lyndsay:
So can we say that as art teachers? Does it bring you joy?
Tim:
Yeah, does it spark joy? Yeah.
Lyndsay:
Yeah. So if someone comes to you and say, Hey, can you do this as a spark joy immediately? No. Um, so I feel that we have to get really good at saying no and holding on to the energy that we do have and stop giving it away so much.
And I am guilty of it as well, Tim, because I, I don’t want to let anybody down or I don’t want to break a student’s heart or I don’t want to, but when we do that, Oh, go ahead.
Tim:
Well, I think a lot of us are people-pleasers, right? And so it’s it’s very difficult to say no. And we’ve done entire podcasts on, you know, why you need to say no. And even if we know that in our head, even if we know that in our heart, it’s still really difficult to do. It’s really difficult to say no to people.
Lyndsay:
And I love that you said that, your head and your heart, but what is your body telling you? If your body’s getting all amped up, if your body’s feeling a certain way and it feels icky or gross, it’s like my unisex t-shirt, when I put it on and it doesn’t feel good, I’m gonna take it off and I’m not gonna put it on again. So I think it’s… um I think there has to be a part in our teachers that we we unite and we we just say politely with respect and kindness, this is not going to work for me. No, thank you. And I think the relief from that is going to be so fulfilling.
And that’s just kind of like another point, too, of coming back to your question of, you know, finding what we love about teaching or remembering what we love about teaching, remembering why.
And I did that at the NOW Conference. One of the prompts was, why did you want to be a teacher? How did you know you wanted to be a teacher? Because I feel like a lot of us, we know it since we’re little. It’s just kind of part of who we are. It’s part of our DNA. We love to teach it just for now. It just happens to be art for us. So it’s what gets you excited.
And for me, for me, it’s I think about all the time I teach kindergartners about printmaking and their reactions when you see how you lift it up and they’re like, or they mix colors or the time that that kid came up out of nowhere and just gave you a hug and say, I love you.
Tim:
Yeah.
Lyndsay:
So it’s, To me, it’s the relationships with my students that I have to focus on because that’s what fills up my heart and fills up my bucket. And as teachers, not many people are filling up our own but are filling up our buckets for us. We are required to fill up our own buckets a lot and that’s a lot of work to teach full-time. We have families, we have friends, we have other things going on.
Tim:
Okay.
Lyndsay:
We go to school and nobody’s filling up our buckets. So I feel like we also have to get better at asking others to do that as well, asking others to fill up our bucket by being nice
Tim:
Great.
Lyndsay:
Helping out, offering to do something. you know there’s There’s all different ways that we can ask others, and it’s not selfish. We can’t be expected to do everything for ourselves all the time. It’s just not possible. It’s just really not. so um So love yourself. Remember why you’re teaching, and if you’re not teaching your best, it’s time to reevaluate. you know It’s time to really, are you getting too far off with that alignment? With being authentic to who you are, what your needs are, and what your desires are.
Tim:
No, but that’s also very well said and I appreciate all of that. I think that’s a good point for teachers, a good spot for them to kind of reflect and and kind of look inward and kind of see how they’re feeling checking in with themselves. I think that’s good advice on how to do that.
Now, I also wanted to talk just another topic that I’ve seen you speak on before, keynotes and other places, just about the idea of vulnerability. And I would love for you to and just kind of in that same vein, talk about the importance of vulnerability and why it helps us to sometimes be vulnerable, even if that is hard to do.
Lyndsay:
Yeah, vulnerable, I feel that has been around for so long, but it’s been such a buzzword, especially with Benne Brown, you know, um just this idea of what it means to be vulnerable.
Tim:
Yeah.
Lyndsay:
And if you ever looked it up on the dictionary, it’s not it’s not a nice definition. I think I looked it up and I said, being open to harm or criticism. And as artists, we’re open to that all the time.
Tim:
Yeah.
Lyndsay:
Whether we signed up for that or not, being an artist, you constantly have people telling telling their opinion to you, whether you ask for it or not. So I feel like we kind of have thick skin you know to get us starting off. But to me, I think i think speaking your truth, no matter what, the matter of the people, no matter the circumstances, that’s what was being vulnerable. It’s coming back to, Being intentional. with you, being intentional with your values, being intentional with your feelings and being intentional with sharing that too.
So an example for me would be, I was in grad class during COVID 2020 and we all had group texts. So we would all get on and watch our professors. We would all be together. And I remember one professor was saying something that we were all just kind of like, oh, I don’t know if this feels right right now.
And she kept going on and kept going on. And I just kept saying the group chat kind of blow up about things. And I spoke up gently and I said, Oh, hey, so and so, you know, I just don’t think I feel comfortable talking about this. Or this is something that wasn’t really what we we were um talking about or this is kind of far off and I feel like this shouldn’t be said right now.
Tim:
Okay.
Lyndsay:
And the amount of texts that I received from the people in my cohort that said, oh my gosh, thank you so much for saying that or I could never do that or I’m so glad that you said something. So everybody, all these people are feeling the same thing, but nobody’s speaking up because why would you want to open yourself up to harm and criticism?
Tim:
Right.
Lyndsay:
It’s hard. It’s really hard to do that. But I think the benefit of that was It’s like a ripple effect, right? So I did it. So maybe maybe that inspires someone else to be like, okay, that wasn’t that bad because me bringing that up, that allowed the other members of my cohort to chime in. And then they spoke up as well and they said, hey, I agree with Lindsay or I think that is okay too. And then my professor’s like, oh, okay, let me fix that. So it’s a disservice I feel if you’re not being honest with something that really resonates with you. Now I will say responsibly that you must show discretion. Vulnerability is not just about airing out your dirty laundry or airing out your grievances or, you know, going on to Google and just writing a nasty review for something. It’s being vulnerable means that it’s true to you, and it’s really touching your core, and you know you want something to change. It’s not being frustrated. It’s not lashing out. It’s something’s not right in your alignment and you want to fix it.
So I encourage folks just to kind of wear vulnerability as like a hat or a cardigan or a piece of jewelry. Try it on and see if it fits. If it doesn’t fit, you spoke up, it didn’t work that well. Okay, take it off and try it again another time until it becomes a permanent part of who you are or like in that analogy, a permanent part of your wardrobe. Because once you start speaking up, speaking kindly in alignment with who you are, it really creates a positive culture that you feel like you can be safe in your group of who you are and able to say something. And even if, I think for me, even if it’s not received well, again, you know, sometimes people do not speak up because they’re afraid of retaliation. They’re afraid of being criticized themselves. But once you start to do that, I feel like it builds your confidence because you know that you’re speaking your truth and nobody can take that away from you. It’s your truth.
It’s your values. You said it. And if people are coming at you, I feel like it’s a confidence booster because you know that you just said what you needed to and what everybody else is saying, it’s just not going to matter to you. So you just represented yourself 100%. Drop that mic and then you walked away because you were representing yourself and you were in truth in that alignment with who you are. So it kind of goes hand in hand with being authentic, being vulnerable. You have to know what you stand for. You have to know your tolerance level and what you are and are not willing to speak up and say.
Tim:
That makes a lot of sense. And I wanted to ask you to talk a little bit about how, you know, you being vulnerable, speaking up really helps other people. If there are other benefits for yourself along with, just being authentic, being vulnerable. Are there other benefits that come with sharing our doubts or sharing our vulnerabilities or or the worries we have?
Lyndsay:
Absolutely. I think it can, I think it can foster closer relationships. If you’re able to tell your best friend, maybe something that you’ve been wanting to tell him or her like forever, and then it can have you guys bond or, um, something else that I was thinking about is, um, opening up and saying something. It can, it can create change. It can really spark something in somebody else.
Tim:
Okay. So let me ask you then next, uh, I want to circle back to the idea of burnout because like I said, we, we know so many people who are feeling that way. So I would love to know what are your suggestions for someone who’s feeling burnt out or feeling like they’ve lost their, their love of teaching. What is the the best path forward for someone who’s feeling like that?
Lyndsay:
Good question. I truly feel stepping away from something does absolute wonders. It’s almost like when you when you’re home for so long and you haven’t had a vacation and you’re just so sick of your house and you’re so sick of cleaning, you’re sick of doing everything and you go on vacation and you’re loving vacation and you’re getting all these new ideas and then it goes on for a little bit and you’re like, wow, I really miss home.
You miss that source, you kind of miss that space that you were just so frustrated with before. um I am a big advocate for taking a break, taking a pause, taking a 10-year break, taking a sabbatical, whatever that looks like. And I know a lot of folks don’t out of fear of losing their job, out of fear, of fear.
Tim:
Right.
Lyndsay:
But I’m a big person for saying step away. And I did that after I taught at the K-8 charter school when it was just me.
And I was just so overwhelmed and depressed. and i I said, I don’t ever want to teach art again. This is just not fun. I don’t like it. I’m not even teaching art. And I stepped away from it. And I tried different things within that time. So I literally, I went to um a school that was offering culinary arts because I was really into baking because the great British,excuse me, the great British baking show came on.
Tim:
Okay, yeah. I was going to say that it’s a great show.
Lyndsay:
And I saw all these beautiful little desserts and isn’t it so great?
Tim:
I know, it’s inspiring.
Lyndsay:
You just want to like pick stuff off the screen. It’s so inspiring and it’s artistic. I’m like, oh my gosh, I can totally do this. So I went on a tour and I’m thinking about it. And could I really change my career midway?
And at the end of the day, I decided not to. I went and got my master’s in art. But because I needed to step away and try something different. I needed something different to remind me. of why I loved art in the first place. And it and it really gave me some space from the school that I was at to realize that that was not a good fit for me.
And I know folks have a hard time with that, with thinking, again, that desperation when I was going to take that parochial school job. I’m desperate. I need a job. I need this and that. But when we’re desperate and we’re making these choices based off of fear, it’s not in an alignment with our a authenticity and our balance of who we are.
Tim:
Hm, fine.
Lyndsay:
So if you’re feeling that way, you’re questioning things, you’re hating arts, you don’t want to teach again, this and that, but you know deep down in your heart, you’re a teacher, I would say just step away. So step away, take a breath, get some different perspectives and just kind of find yourself again. And, you know, you’re never really lost from yourself. I feel like we just get buried. I feel like our true desires, our passions, our desires, our happiness just gets buried under all the muck and the burnout and everything that’s required of us that is not teaching.
Tim:
Oh, that’s, I don’t know, it gives me a lot to think about. And I love the idea of, you know, we’re not getting separated from what we want. It’s tough to find it because it can get better. That’s a great analogy for that. Now, my last question for you. I love to close the podcast out with some advice for listeners. You’ve given us a lot of good advice already, but do you have anything else that you want to share, some words of encouragement or advice about authenticity, vulnerability, loving teaching, or just anything else along those lines that you would want to share with everyone?
Lyndsay:
Yeah, for everyone listening, I’m so proud of you and I’m so grateful for you and your choices that you’re making for yourself and for your students. You are making an absolute, absolute difference in their lives. And i just I just want to share that you’re more than just a teacher. Your students observe you. They look at you. They analyze how you talk, react, respond, and interact.
So if you’re not 100% yourself, if you are not going to be yourself, what your students are gaining from you is not your true self. And that is a big disservice to them and to you. So always make sure that you are in an alignment with your authenticity and your good as gold.
Tim:
Yeah, I love that. I think that is very well said and some very good advice. and Appreciate the encouragement for everyone as well. So Lindsay, thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciated you being vulnerable, sharing so much ah about yourself, your own experience and and how that can help everyone else as well. So it’s been a great conversation and we really appreciate it.
Lyndsay:
Well, thanks, Tim, and thanks to the Art of Education University. I love you all so much, and I’m looking forward to seeing you all again in the future.
Tim:
Love it. Thanks.
Lyndsay:
Thank you.
Tim:
Thank you to Lyndsay for coming on, I’ve really enjoyed hearing all of her ideas, how she explains things, and just the message that I think a lot of us need to hear when it comes to how we think about our teaching. Two things, in particular, that stood out to me, were the idea that it’s okay for us to say no–in fact, it’s better for us to sometimes say no. That was a lesson that was very hard for me to learn as a teacher, and something we have talked about a lot on this podcast in the past. So if you are new, please take that message to heart, and if you are experienced, please take that as a reminder. The second thing that stood out to me from Lyndsay was the idea that we need to take time to ourselves. That’s another message we have talked about a lot on the pod, and another I would encourage you to reflect on. What are you doing for yourself? How do you take time for yourself? And how do those things make you a better teacher. Something very much worth reflecting on as we move forward through this school year.
Art Ed Radio is produced by the Art of Education University, with audio engineering from Michael Crocker. Thank you, as always, for listening, and we will talk to you again next week!
Magazine articles and podcasts are opinions of professional education contributors and do not necessarily represent the position of the Art of Education University (AOEU) or its academic offerings. Contributors use terms in the way they are most often talked about in the scope of their educational experiences.