Behind the Scenes of the Art Room Makeover (Ep. 399)

Welcome to Art Ed Radio, the podcast for art teachers. This show is produced by the Art of Education University, and I’m your host, Tim Bogatz. 

If you are a regular listener to the podcast, you probably have picked up a few snippets from us about traveling to Baltimore and doing an art room makeover. 

I also teased it at the end of last week’s episode, but we have three guests today to talk all about the art room makeover. 

Lindsey McGinnis, my colleague and mastermind of the art room makeover is here.
Dalitso Chinkhota, the teacher whose room we made over, is here.
Melvin Twine, the Art Department Chair at Dalitso’s school, is also here. So you’ll hear from a couple of people on the AOEU side of things, and a couple of teachers on the other side of the makeover. I’m thrilled to talk to everyone today.

Before we get into the conversation, I need to tell you that we have the results of the makeover! We have three YouTube episodes up now, documenting the process and showing you some awesome DIY projects. They are great! Imagine an HGTV makeover show, but for an art room–it’s very cool, the episodes are so much fun. We’re really proud of all of it, and we would love for you to check it out.

In fact–this podcast might be more fun if you go watch those episodes first! You can find the links to the show notes, or you can just go AOEU’s YouTube page and find the episodes. 

The first episode is an introduction, showing you everything that was happening as we started the makeover. The second has 4 different DIY projects that you could do in your art room, and the third has the dramatic reveal and the results of the makeover. You will love hearing and seeing Dalitso’s reaction to everything.

We would love you to watch the episodes, like, subscribe, leave a couple of comments, all of that good stuff! Hit pause on this podcast, go watch some art room makeover episodes, and come back and listen for an even better podcast interview, which–if you didn’t hit pause, we’ll go ahead and start now.

All right, I have three guests joining me today, so let me introduce all three. Lindsey McGinnis, how are you?

I’m good. How are you Tim?

Great. Looking forward to this conversation. Melvin Twine, how are you today?

I’m doing great. How are you doing, Tim?

Oh, great. Great. And Dalitso Chinkota, owner of the art room Makeover. Super excited to have him join as well. Dalitso, how are you?

It’s a beautiful day in the neighborhood, so glad to be here with you, Tim.

All right, love it. Glad to have you all here and looking forward to this conversation because we had such a great time making over the art room. But I guess we should probably set the stage because everybody saw the art room on the YouTube series, but I would love to just get a description from everybody of just what the art room looked like before we did the entire makeover. So Dalitso, can i put that to you first? How would you describe your art room before the makeover happened?

It was old, yellow like mustard, outdated, and the kids didn’t feel that it was inviting or welcoming enough.

Yeah.

It was old.

What year is your school?

Wow, that is a good question.

It’s about 60 years old.

Yeah.

Okay. Was the art room original from 60 years ago?

Yes, yes. The only thing that was new is probably the student work that I showcased in the room. And of course the desks and the tables are newer than when the building was constructed, so that’s been a change.

Yeah. Like you said, it’s old. It’s at least 60 years old and it’s a typical art room for this particular county, I guess. We have an overcrowded classroom, overcrowded school, and obviously overcrowded classroom. So what you see is trying to manage 35 to 40 kids in a space that’s maybe comfortable for maybe 20. But yeah, it’s come a long way and it was due for a makeover badly.

All right. So Lindsey, let me ask you, and Melvin says it’s due for a makeover. When you first saw it, you love this makeover stuff. Were you super excited or was this like, “Oh, this is going to be a challenge?” What were your first impressions?

It was of course both because a really terrible room to begin with will make for a really good makeover, but it was very dark because there’s no windows in that room, but there’s a lot of doors that go to other doors.

Other classrooms through the closet.

Yeah.

We even found secret doors. So that was pretty exciting.

Yeah.

I was going to say, so now with the makeover, I don’t know, it felt like I was just there for three days, but it felt like the biggest change for me was just how bright it is, changing that dingy yellow color to this fresh white coat of paint. Everything was really bright. Dalitso, is that what you’ve noticed the most? As far as the change?

I can definitely say that the kids, the first thing when they walked in the room, they were like, “Oh my god, this looks like a white school. It’s not even our school.” I was like, “What?” And then some would say, “Oh, it’s bright in here, my eyesight, I got to adjust to the lighting. It reminds me of an insane asylum.” And I was like, “Don’t worry, over time, you will get used to it because I’m so used to it.” I think the day of the reveal when I got in here, I was like, “I don’t want to go home. I want to stay in this room. I don’t want anybody to mess my stuff up or take my things and my belongings, I don’t have time for that.” So I was like, “I guess I got to go home, but I’ll be back tomorrow though.” And I’m looking forward for the kids see it.

I think for me, the most important thing was yes, how bright it is. But organization was definitely key. Because I’m still trying to declutter the closet, but I’m trying to stay true to what you guys did. I’m like, “I don’t want to mess their work up because it looks so good.” But definitely the students have noticed the difference and for me, it feels good. It does. It feels like a whole new environment. Look forward to coming in, look forward to imparting new information with the kids and so do they.

That’s cool. That’s really good. Really good. And how’s the closet cleaning going so far?

It’s still the same as you guys left it. So now it’s a matter of me taking time to actually remove things that I don’t use, take things that I don’t use so I can get it out of here. We try to make sure it’s still the same look as what you guys left.

Now, Melvin, what’s your impression of the room? Is it still staying organized, would you say?

Yeah, you could tell the kids… Well now after the kids because he has to put things away again, but I could see the kids actually using… The kids, they could come in, grab what they need, they know where it is. There’s no asking Mr. Chinkota where things are, they can just grab and sit down and start producing work. And the organization is a lot better. And I can see the kids, me just walking past in the hallway way, I can see the kids, they know where things are and it clicks a lot faster with the kids.

Yeah. And so-

And I think the kids are more relaxed when they come in, they know where things are. They don’t have to ask, they don’t have to wait for Chinkota to answer. They just grab and go.

Yep, yep. That makes a lot of sense. So Lindsey, can you talk about the strategies you were thinking about as far as organizing that like what you put together and why it works for students?

Well, we first got rid of a lot of stuff or Twine got rid of a lot of stuff so that only the thing that the students need is there. They have less to sort through or wade through. So that really helps. And then we got all these clear bins so students can see through them and they have lids that are attached to the bins. You don’t lose the lid, they stack. We have labels on them and those can be interchanged later if you want to swap out the materials in them. And they’re all on the open shelving that we cleaned off, so students can go and grab it, which is like Twine said, really important. Especially when you have 40 kids, you don’t have time to tell 40 kids where everything is.

Yeah, that has definitely, definitely been instrumental because they know that it’s a clear box and they just go in there, grab the materials that they need. Because what I used to have issues with in the past was they would just leave materials or items left on the table and go, and I’d always be like, “Try to put things back where they came from.” But they were too lazy to do that. But now I don’t know whether it’s because of the clear or just the organization itself, but they take ownership and actually clean it up before they disappear. So I’m like, “Wow.” It’s a big change from just a transformation of a room. And so Lindsey, to your idea of the clear boxes is definitely instrumental when the kids see it and they’re actually using it accordingly. So thank you for that.

That’s awesome.

Hey, now I wanted to ask. Other systems, is everything else still running pretty smoothly? I think Lindsey was very curious about whether the pencil sharpener is still holding up this long.

So you know what’s amazing, they actually using the little portable handheld pencil sharpeners you have in the clear cases.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

They go in there, clean it. The only thing they don’t do, they don’t like to clean it out. So they’ll use a sharpener and then put it back. I haven’t opened the big one yet because I was like, “I’m going to save you for later.” When these break down, I’m going to bring the big juggernaut out.

Okay, okay.

Yes.

So what else is going on in the room? What else from the makeover is working or the kids are reacting well to? Are there things that maybe were a misfire, things that didn’t work as much?

Well, I guess the only thing, but everything is working good. The only one that’s misfiring at the present time is the portfolio holder. So what it is, because I have different classes, what they tend to do is sometimes instead of looking at where it’s located, they just start putting things. So then I have to go back and reorganize, because I’ll find a 3A and a 2B and a 2B and a four. And I was like, “How did you…” So I’m like, “You know what? It is what it is.” So we’re going to figure it out. We’re going to figure it out. But that’s the only one. But otherwise, we’re using everything, so it’s been working out.

Now. Are you using the podium?

Always.

Because we’re pretty proud of the podium. We like that.

Always. No, listen, I’m using the podium. The only one I’m not using is the trash can as far as the ball because I’m like, “I don’t want you to take my ball and mess my stuff up.” So that one looks cute and then there’s three trash cans in front of it anyway, but the kids are using it and the custodial staff cleans it out. At first, they were trying to pick it up, but they realized it was too heavy. They’re like, “Man.” So they replace the bag.

There’s a sandbag!

I was going to say there’s like a 50-pound sandbag in the bottom of that.

Yeah, yeah. So they realize, “Okay, we can’t pick this up.” Literally, I think the biggest change is that the kids and how they feel about when they walk in and them actually getting started getting in the process of working and being able to find materials easily and be able to return it easily. So it’s like a well-oiled machine. So that’s been very helpful.

Now for you, Dalitso, has it been a change for you to go from writing on the chalkboard to having that new marker board, that whiteboard that’s there? Has that been weird for you?

It’s funny, I love it because now I don’t have to worry about trying to erase something because now not only that, but because you got a whiteboard, it literally makes the room so much bigger. But yeah, it’s been very helpful because now I don’t have to worry about trying to get this white stuff off my hands.

Chalk.

Yeah. And it lasts longer because sometimes those kids like to lean on it and stuff. But it lasts longer. And also using the different markers, like objective and warmups and whatever other instructions I got to put on is definitely helpful instead of trying to find chalks that are different color, because I had same color, but this one, I could color code it and just definitely helpful as well.

I also want to ask, did kids react well to the posters that are up? The artwork that we hung up, other things like that? How were they feeling about that?

They do, they do. And the one thing they actually noticed was everything, how it circles through the room from you’ve been drafted to meet the players and the game plan. So they actually noticed everything in the game rules and whatnot. So they like the seamlessness and how they feel like they’re involved because they feel like they’re part of a team, if you will, and they’ve been selected to be in here. And then you’ve got the kids who wish they were in the class. Now they’re like, “Oh my god, I wish I could be in your class now.” Or the former students are like, “Why they got to make the change when we’re gone? Oh my gosh.” And then I got to apologize, but maybe one day your son or daughter will be in here too.

There you go.

One day. But yeah, so it’s been a big change, a good change.

Now that your keyboard and your microphone are out, are they still out and are you singing more?

So the microphone, I’m using. The keyboard, I got to get my plug because now I’m more motivated to learn how to play the keyboard. I’m like, “I don’t know how to play the keyboard.” But I’m like, “What’s the point of having something? I’m not trying to learn how to use it?” And then of course, I have kids who are very interested in trying to play the instruments. So I’m like, “Okay, after you finished doing your work, or if I notice that there’s progress in your work, I don’t mind you going to play or I don’t mind you getting on the microphone.” But until then, no, no, no. So the microphone is definitely still being used. I’m actually purchasing a new one because I was like, “I’m tired of replacing these AA batteries.” So I’m going to buy rechargeable batteries for microphone. So I Amazoned yesterday, two sets. So it’s coming.

Melvin, can you tell us a little bit about how other people in the building reacted? Like what other teachers thought, what your principal or your administrators thought when they saw the makeover?

Some of them actually ironically, were jealous. They automatically assume the art room was already taken care of. They don’t need this, they don’t need that because they don’t think we’re important enough to have such a makeover. So I tell them, we’re just as important, we see more kids than you do. Most of the time, we average 40 kids, you might have 15 to 20 in English and science class. But I think the biggest thing, a lot of the teachers, they express that they wish they had their room made over. I was like, “Well, maybe one day you might, but this time it’s for Chinkota.”

And administration, two of them that I spoke to, they really enjoyed coming into the room. It’s completely different, the color, the organization, some of them like the posters, especially because it lays out the plan, but the kids could see a plan, but not everybody’s… They read every little thing, but the photographs and the images on the posters help them out a lot. So a lot of them are more visual than they are actually getting up close to read everything. So they enjoyed it a lot when they came in to visit the room the first time around.

Oh, cool. That’s really cool.

I had some colleagues that were afraid to walk into the room. I was like, “You can step into the room, it’s okay.” It’s still in the same building. I know it’s a whole new atmosphere, but it’s still the same building. You can walk in. They’re like, “Oh my goodness, how did you do it? How long did it take you?” I was like, “Listen, I’ve been blessed, man. I’ve been blessed.” PG County, big. Pull up anytime. And some of the administrators who come in, they’re like, “Oh, I love what they’ve done. It’s a nice place.” But then they keep going. I was like, “I wanted more.” I want you to tell me more. So I think Twine may have gotten more reaction than I expected. Because I think they were just coming in doing business, “Hey, I’m picking up this person. Oh, it looks beautiful. This person I’m picking up.” And I’m like, “But I want more. Tell me more. What else are you thinking?” But yeah, so it’s been different reactions to staff members as well.

I’ve been in the building for 30 years and I’ve been looking at the same dingy not so much in my room, but the same dingy yellow for 30 years. And for them to come in and see a completely a different color on the wall and help and how much like you see on HGTV, you see complete, it changes everything when we walk into the room, you don’t see. They can see it actually firsthand instead this on the TV screen. So they see what color does to a room.

Lindsey, what were you going to say?

What did the rest of your department think? And the teacher who shares your room?

So the teacher who shares the room with me, he liked it. He was very surprised because he was like, “Wow, it’s so minimal.” Because we used to have the cabinets and all-

Oh yeah, yeah.

Things in the back or whatever. He was like, “Wow, man. It’s like it’s simplified.” And I was like, “Yeah, they did that.” And then of course he was excited later to actually have a desk as well.

That’s fair, yep.

Oh yeah, yeah. Simple and straight to the point. And the fact that it moves and tilts and all that stuff, it’s helpful too to adjust and all that. So he was very excited. And not only that, his students were excited as well because now they’re able enjoy the fruits of the labor in that they could come and get the materials however they needed and go back to their seats and then put it back as well. So it’s good to see that they too are enjoying it as well.

And he has special ed kids. I haven’t been here every day since the makeover, but once or twice I’ve been in there, you could see the organization helps them out a great deal

Because before, their caretakers would be the ones going to get materials for them. But now you see the special education kids going to get materials themselves because now they know what they want, what they’re looking for, and then take it to their workstation. And even when they finish, they take ownership by actually putting stuff back where it came from before they disappear. So it’s a blessing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That’s very cool. And Dalitso, do you feel like is a lasting change, do you feel like this is how your room’s going to stay for a while now?

Well, I guess the question is how much better can it get from what you guys did? Unless they’re going to give me a whole television that’s a whiteboard. A smartboard for the entire whiteboard. This is about as great as it gets. So yes, I’m looking forward to this being that. I’m just hoping, and I’m almost like, “Please don’t anybody use markers or something on my walls because I like the way they look.” Even my sink, some of the leftover whiteboard, I’ve actually placed it on the wall. So if the water splatters, I can clean it easily instead of having a white wall that was just full of colors before that. So I’m hoping or praying that it stays looking like this for a long time.

Is there anything that you go to go look for and it’s not there and you’re like, “Where did that thing go?”

No, actually, you know what it is? Sometimes out of sight, out of mind. If I’m not looking for it, if I didn’t miss it, then I’m not looking for it. And so I think for me, I had an apprehension when you were like, “We’re going to remove these cabinets off this wall and we’re going to have it all open.” And I’m feeling to myself, “Oh my gosh, I like to hide all my materials. I don’t want people having access to those things because if I’m gone and substitute is here, then I can’t police these things.”

You have a closet.

But the kids have really truly surprised me. They have in that they maintain things even when I’m not here. So that’s a blessing in itself to even though that and to see that and experience it as well. So no, there’s nothing that I’m missing. I’m like, “Oh man, I wish this was there or that was there.” I think you guys have added to what I needed, what I didn’t know I needed. You guys have definitely added to that. So definitely grateful and appreciative of that.

I think kids really can feel like you care about them because they have a new room and so they want to take care of it now.

Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. And the kids know whether it was the makeover or not. They genuinely know like, “Hey, listen, this guy does care about us.” So the fact that the makeover did happen, it’s like, “Yeah, you deserve it.” So I’m like, “Thank you, Guys.”

So one item that Twine found in your closet that I was specifically wondering if you were missing at this time of year was a Christmas tree and a whole box of Christmas decorations.

And now that you brought that up, I think I need to set it up. I just got to figure out where I can set that up and light it up. You know what? We’re good. We’re good.

He didn’t know it was missing.

It’s true, it’s true. So we’re good. We don’t have to worry about that.

But like a new tree. That one was sad-looking.

Like a sad Charlie Brown Christmas tree.

Yeah. It’s funny because I don’t know if it was still inside the trash can because I always thought it was in the trash can or whatever.

It was.

And I haven’t opened that trash can. So that’s why I didn’t know that was gone.

What was the weirdest thing that you thought was in your room? Because we all went around and talked about the weirdest thing that we thought was in your room.

Yeah.

What do you think it was?

So you mean after the makeover?

No, that you kept hidden in your room.

Weirdest thing that I kept.

Want me to tell you what I thought?

Yeah. Share what your thought was.

I was like, “Why has he got a bag of weaves? Why is this weave in your storage room, that should be in the trash 10 years ago?”

This is the best.

So listen-

Explain why you got a weave.

I’ve got a explanation for the weave. Actually, my wife was getting rid of some wigs and stuff, and one of my coworkers asked me to remake a sculpture of Nat Turner that somebody had thrown away. It was chewed up by mice and rats and all that stuff. I even got a video on my YouTube channel, so I literally had to remake the whole thing. I put some copper wire on there, had a stand up, wrapped it up with cardboard, repainted it. And so when it came to putting the hair on there, I didn’t have anything. And not long ago, I had cut my son’s hair. And so I took my son’s hair and glued it onto this thing for his beard and the hair and all that stuff. And somebody was like, “Man, that’s voodoo. You can’t be doing that.” And I was like, “I hope nobody ever puts magical stuff on this thing because my son will be…” Yeah.

So when my wife was getting rid of her hair, I was like, “One day I’m going to use it for something. I don’t know what, but you’re coming with me. You’re going to stay in my room and I’m going to use you.” But that’s why I got that stuff in there.

But it’s gone now, in other words.

I’ll buy some more, no. Or if she gets rid of some more stuff, I’ll find it.

You got so much in there, you’ve got room.

It’s true, it’s true. I don’t even know if I can find something that I can say that was weird in there. There’s old records that are in there, and I was like, “But there’s no record players, so what’s it in here for?” Printmaking ink, old ones. I’m talking about way before the water-based stuff or whatever. It was still in there, dried up, caked up. And I was like, “Wow.” But yet somehow, I’m always thinking I’m captain save-a-thing or whatever. I was like, “One day I’m going to bring you back to life and use you again.” Knowing good well, I was never going to do that. So I think that’s the only thing I could think that was weird in the closet that I got-

This is all normal stuff to you.

Yeah. But I think that’s the only thing I could think.

But do you catch yourself now? If you pass something that’s being thrown away, are you still like, “I need to take this and put it in my closet?” Or do you think twice?

I do, I do, but then I have to remind myself that it was remade. So I don’t need that. So I do catch myself saying I’m not doing that anymore. If it’s going to be somewhere out where it can be seen, then I can’t keep it.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. So I’m like, “I don’t want to mess up the aesthetic of what it looks like now.”

Anything else you guys want to share before we go?

I think for the most part, truly grateful, truly grateful to you guys and the great work that you guys did. And it’s going to be long-lasting. And it’s definitely impactful for the present students and the future students who will be coming through the room and learning from me.

Good, good. We love doing it. And I think we’re all hopeful that it can be beneficial for a really long time. So thanks for letting us come into your room and do what we did. We had a lot of fun with it.

It was our pleasure. It was our pleasure.

Thank you.

Mm-hmm.

Tim Bogatz:

Again, go watch the art room makeover episodes if you haven’t done that, like, subscribe, comment, and check out the giveaway announcement. And if you enjoyed the episodes, we will have a behind-the-scenes video being released on Thursday. Make sure you check it out!

But until then, thank you to Lindsey for the incredible amount of planning, logistics, and effort that went into spearheading this, to Melvin for helping us throughout the entire makeover, even though it wasn’t even his room, and of course Dalitso for trusting us with his room through the whole process!. And thanks to all 3 of them for coming on today. From beginning to end, the art room makeover has been an incredible experience. 

Art Ed Radio is produced by the Art of Education University with audio engineering from Michael Crocker. Thank you as always for listening!

A couple of housekeeping notes before I wrap things up . . . AOEU is going to be closed from December 22nd until January 2nd, so during those weeks, we will have a couple of archived episodes up in the podcast feed. Just preparing you now!

That also means the next mailbag episode will not be until the SECOND Tuesday in January. I would love for you to to email Amanda and me with questions for the January mailbag! You can also leave us a voicemail by calling (515) 209-2595. We would love to hear from you!